July 31, 2010

Huge Nerf to Job Energy:XP Ratios

As I am sure you will notice as soon as you log in, jobs in all cities now pay out less experience points for the same energy cost. On a few jobs the EXP:Energy got better, but the vast majority, including the two best jobs in game, suffered a big hit. Settle a Beef Permanently now pays out 69 XP (old: 73) and Battle Your Way Through The Temple pays out 379 XP (old: 403):



Now, this is the second time we've seen this nerf. About a month ago, Top Mafia Wheelman and Mastermind bonuses dropped from 11% to 10%.

There was a forum post on the official Zynga forums back when they first tried to implement the huge nerf with the changes to Top Mafia. XP:Energy ratios dropped to somewhere around 1.7-1.8 even for the best jobs. Players complained and their daily annual users dropped significantly.

They ultimately reversed it, but I noticed one curious post. One player recommended that they slowly nerf it over time, nicking a little here and there, until it was reduced to their desired level. One of the developers (who rarely posts) replied that he thought it was a great idea. And that is what it looks like they're doing.

Now, this is the second time they've done this, so they are sure to do it again. However, this is the real first nerf where players will start to feel it. Losing a few energy and experience points here and there did not really effect anyone greatly, especially when there were still a lot of repeatable jobs in game which paid over 2 XP:Energy.

Now however, there are no non-consumable jobs which have a high XP:Energy ratio. Energy account leveling is effectively dead, and no new players will be able to level up energy accounts. No new players will be able to reach end-game in any decent amount of time, and naturally players will quit Mafia Wars (just like any game) and move onto greener pastures. In my opinion, this is the beginning of the end of Mafia Wars.

Looking at the Monthly Annual User count, it experienced a huge spike yesterday:

http://www.appdata.com/apps/facebook/10979261223

but the Daily Annual Users (DAU) barely budged. Not sure what exactly caused the huge spike, but it seems they may have timed whatever the reason for this to coincide with this nerf as if the players wouldn't notice.

I think that the DAU will continue to drop over the next few days. Mafia Wars is far to old to be making all of these changes. It's a sinking ship (its a text-based game over 2 years old), so I think it's getting to be time to prepare to cut their losses and launch Mafia Wars 2.

Here are some things to think about for a future Mafia Wars:

- Level Cap

  • Would stop exploiters from reaching level 5983 if you could only hit level 100)
  • Would prevent it becoming "too late" for new players to join and reach the top
  • Would make new expansions much more exciting

- Automatic Stat Distribution
  • This would allow developers to actually balance a game since everyone has the same stats. You wouldn't have to tune the game to "punish" energy account or fighting account players. Everyone would have the same account.
  • Would keep players from breaking the game by stacking one stat exclusively
  • Customization of stats could be offered by small ways to gain points, like the Chop Shop
  • Would make players put points in stats like HP which are typically referred to as worthless
- Each expansion (new city), raise the level cap.
  • Raising level caps makes new cities more exciting. It's not "just another city" but a way to notice a significant increase in your character's strength while doing new content
  • The new levels would offer significant stat point bonuses
  • Raising the level cap would remove the barrier for entry for new players. By offering significant bonuses to stat points for new levels, everyone gets reset to roughly the same skill level. Older players enjoy some bonus skill points from daily activities and having better loot, but newer players won't struggle to reach the top
----

Any other ideas for a new Mafia Wars? It is inevitable after all. Imagine yourself as a new player competing against other accounts that are level 2,000+. How would these new players ever even think about finishing Bangkok, which requires nearly 200 energy for some jobs? Not going to happen in this lifetime without an energy account.
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90 comments:

  1. This might be the best news on earth for me. I spend way too much time with this game anyway, and every day they add more and more stuff you got to do everyday, lotto, tournements, wars, fights, jobs, crimespree, properties, daily list, etc etc. I never understood the problem with the energy and leveling. Lets be honest. A new player on the game before nerfs, could within 2 months be on the same level as me, with all the same loot as me, and who knows maybe win fights against me. I spend alot of time getting the 501 best of everything, to one week later have a whole new +2 higher loot, to redo the 501 of everything. Anyway the level # is insignificant, level 500 people beat level 10000 people everyday fighting. Esp if the level 10000 guy is a true energy account. I do not know how they would roll it out, but I truly doubt I will go to mw2. Could be time for a new hobby.

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  2. Well, I'd hope that they'd roll it out just like every other video game in history.

    They'd try a bunch of experiments on new game features on the current place (just like they are doing right now rolling out 10 different things at a time). They'd collect player feedback.

    They'd start to code MW2.

    As player interest faded in the original, as it continues to do now. On appdata you can see we're down to 4 million daily players from I believe around 7 million at the beginning of 2010.

    There are definitely still enough people playing this game to keep it alive, but if the trend continues we'll be down to 3 million by the end of the year, under 3 million by 2011 (or sooner), and by that point they should be looking at MW2.

    At this point, they should release a beta test and invite a mix of players, inviting many of the long-term MW players along with selecting some completely new people. Run beta, get feedback, test, balance, tweak. They'd announce this, build up hype, leave messages in their other games, etc.

    A few weeks out they'd start promoting its release (spending money on advertising before the game was even available).

    Then Mafia Wars 2 would come out, hopefully they'd give it a very very large server so it doesn't crash/lag on release day (which kills so many games), tons of people would play it, and we'd be back up to 7 million daily annual users.

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  3. I should note that several Las Vegas missions still offer better than a 2:1 ratio at tiers 3 and 4 of districts 4 and 5. I've got ratios for tier 4 but I remember some of the missions had really good ratios at tier 3 in district 5.

    District 4 (Shogun Casino):
    Steal a Valet's Uniform: 2.01
    Hack The Casino Security System (requires consumable): 2.11

    District 5 (Mojave Desert):
    Arrange a Cartel Sale: 2.01
    Dispose of the Evidence (requires consumable): 2.03

    This is to say nothing of the fight path jobs which provide up to 2.17 xp per stamina expended (Clean out Biker Bar in District 5 at tier 4). I'm still level cranking to my heart's content trying to get the gear together to take down those bosses. . .

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  4. I understand what you are saying, but is the speed at which my character levels is not that important to me.

    You make some valid comments, but honest and truthfully, for me the most important thing is Baht right now. That is what Zygna needs to fix and boost the cost of exp to payout for Baht. Either that or decrease the cost of the required items. This is killing me and REALLY slowing me down in advancement. For me, I really don't care about the advancement as much as the monies and strength of my character. I beat level 2000+ characters right now and I'm only level 688.

    Now, I don't buy my loot. I like the challenge of getting loot the old fashion way, so I'm not that powerful compared to other players, but it is relaxing doing the jobs / fighting / robbing to get the loot.

    I understand what you are saying, but new players really won't notice any different, if you ask me. If the higher players quit, eventually the whole Mafia Wars world will balance out in the end.

    I have played multiple on-line games and everytime the developers make changes, people complain and quit and say that the game is going to die - but yet, those games are still alive and kicking. IN the end, it all balances out.

    Just my 2-cents. Happy looting!

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  5. Wouldn't DAU mean Daily "Active" Users? Also, for the MAU, if this is measured just once a month then that would trigger the change. This would also explain why it was flat for the last 7 days. Just speculating, keep up the good work.

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  6. I checked out of mafia wars a couple weeks ago. They had a huge glitch last month that completely froze me out of the South Africa event. Their customer service was lousy, there was no new content available afterward, and Las Vegas looks really stupid, so I had nothing to keep me coming back.

    Now I DEFINITELY have no reason to come back.

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  7. Mafia wars eugenics, nice to see who's side they're on... that's fascist/communist/marxist philosophy of control, slowly chip away at you until you give in, any1 who know's what i'm talking about, is that you stay away from this kind of bulls**t.

    you could practice the giving approach, rather than giving/taking philantrpy nonsense

    good eyes "mafia wars guide"

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  8. Wasn't the Dragon Head Teir level 4 job percentage at 1% now its 2% when I do it. Maybe it was a glitch for me or something. My random thought on change would be to allow us to convert energy to stamina and/or the other way around. Like the Vegas money conversion. One time in 24 hours to move in whatever dirrection you want that day. Fighting/robbing or Jobs. Justa thought...

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  9. if i look at las vegas (district 3 and 5 bosses)
    they are very hard but i think las vegas wants you to be a balanced player
    Defense/attack mostly used in boss fights
    stamina(much) needed to do fights
    energy to do normal jobs
    health to keep longer alive against bosses

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  10. well, they have to slow the game down. i can level up with a ratio of 2.1. I did all the las vegas content, exept of the ruby bosses 3 and 5, in just one day. that is way too fast.
    and if you are a really strong player, then you still have the possibility of the las vegas tournament to stock up your xp. with the heavyweight class you get a ratio of 12:1.
    so, it isn't that crappy...

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  11. District 5 (Mojave Desert):
    Arrange a Cartel Sale: 2.01


    This is the one I've been spamming. With the occasional mastermind bonuses, I can still loop it through levels with very few delays.

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  12. by the way, the biggest crap still is the 501 mafia size, nobody has 501 real friends playing that game but you are forced to stock up you mafia, otherwise you have no chance in fights...

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  13. This is a very bad move for Zygna.
    (level 1000+, balanced player)

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  14. does anybody know when they'll release district 6?

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  15. @ anonymous: it's where all my reward points go to and last week I finally got to a mafia of 501. It took me about 10 months. Only 50 or so are real life friends. The others I bought with reward points. Those points I earned, I never bought them with real money. So, if people who do not want to invite tons of people they don't know have an option like this, the 501 mafia size isn't to bad.

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  16. On the other hand, I think Mafia Wars has suddenly become the easiest game to level. Have you seen the energy / stamina ratio for the boss fights in vegas? You can fight the boss again and again as long as you haven't completed one of the earlier jobs of that district.

    I am a balanced player, 700+attack, 600+stamina, I can defeat bosses without using consumables.

    Mr. Mafia Wars Guide, I think you speak only on behalf of energy accounts when you say that the game is dead. For balanced & fighting players, Mafia Wars is now the best game ever!!

    Now, I don't know how to check the DAU or MAU. But depending upon how literally in a blink of an eye, the fight list becomes all ICED, it does seem to me that fighters are truly rooling the game right now.

    Regards,
    Don Hugs

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  17. Uhh, I meant "experience / stamina" ratio not "energy / stamina" ratio

    Also, "ruling" not "rooling"

    Regards,
    Don Hugs

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  18. the buy off a federal agent in boss is 2.16
    the help get an associate a no bid contract is 2.12

    but both take consumables, if you are a daily player you no doubt have thousands of politicos for the no bid

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  19. @Don Hugs: On ruby? Or gold? I have 1000/1000 defense / attack and I can't take boss with consumablesin ruby.

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  20. @Fruiko: So far only in ruby and silver,

    But the health of the boss seems to be a random number every time. If I get a number say 10k+, I just close the mozzila tab (I don't press "run away").
    I click on boss fight til I get a managable health, around 8000 is easily managable without consumables for my level 750 account

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  21. I really hope they fix this and just stay with the original, I worked too hard for it all to go down the drain if Mafia Wars 2 comes out...

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  22. who cares about how fast you level? that is an energy player's qualm.

    " Imagine yourself as a new player competing against other accounts that are level 2,000+."

    MOST players with levels like that are PURE energy. level means absolutely nothing in this game. why does everyone forget that this game is called mafia WARS and not mafia JOBS? i hear so many people say "well i would never hit them...they are 100 (200, 500, 2000) levels higher than me." even without spending money i can murder people thousands of levels higher than me bc i am NOT an energy account. yes, leveling takes a long time, but it doesnt matter.

    and i have a question: what is the point in maxing in top loot if you play an energy account? it isnt going to matter!

    @fruiko: unless you are relatively low level (300 or less), 1000 A&D is not very high. and how much health do you have? that is helpful in boss fights.

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  23. A lot of players care about leveling. there is always a varied level of gratification in being able to complete all the jobs available that many fighting accounts are unable to complete due to a lack of energy points.

    True, fighting is more important in displaying your true strength in this game, but at this point many dedicated and competitive players have energy accounts (that now have high stamina as well from daily chop shop production) IN ADDITION to fighting or balanced accounts not to show off a high level but to farm loot items as well as consumables that fighting accounts are unable to attain through continuous leveling.

    Now that Zynga has nerfed certain jobs including the two highest paying jobs, those energy accounts can still level more quickly than fighting accounts due to a "healthy" combination of energy and stamina points.

    As for me I have a main balanced account and 2 high energy/stamina farming accounts, but I am pulling the plug and freeing myself from the chains of Zynga.

    Happy clicking everyone!

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  24. @^
    and i have a question: what is the point in maxing in top loot if you play an energy account? it isnt going to matter!

    Me? I send em all to my "balanced" account. Getting all 501 HEL with ~1k energy is a pain, but farming them with a 10k energy account and send all 501 to another one of my account work wonders :D

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  25. AFTER INVESTING 2 YEARS PLAYING THIS GAME, I HAVE NO INTEREST PLAYING A NEW MAFIA WARS 2 !!!

    I SPEAK FOR MANY OF US (ABOUT 45 THAT WE PLAY DAILY) AND 43 OF US, HAVE SAID THEY WILL QUIT MAFIA WARS IF THEY HAVE TO START ALL OVER AGAIN IN A NEW VERSION. THAT GOES EVEN FURTHER FOR PEOPLE WHO HAVE INVESTED REAL MONEY INTO THE GAME.

    IMROVEMENTS SHOULD BE MADE ON THE EXISTING GAME, NOT ROLLING OUT A NEW GAME.

    AFTER ALL, WE ALL HAVE REAL LIFES, TO KEEP ON STARING A NEW VERSION EVERY 2-3 YEARS

    NIKOLAOS

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  26. I agree with the previous comment... so your calculations of 7 mil users on the new version is not based on reality...after all this work, I finally get to enjoy with game, I will hate to start all over... I will stop playing as well :-0

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  27. IMHO - the vast majority (maybe over 85%) of the pure energy accounts, are secondary (or third) farming account belonging to an balanced (or pure fighting) one.

    Thatswhy i dont believe the lowering of the XP:Energy ratio will do sooo much harm to the game, even the complete oposite, it will balance things out.

    LV is a very good start, and i hope they go this way through, which will maybe kick out some of the energy players, but will make the game far more fun for the rest who stays.

    Another idea (a very radical one :)) will be that Zynga just dissables the gifting functionality :))

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  28. I agree with players who wants to continue with this version of game. Mather of fact, situation is quite simple how to make this game work.
    Leave big exp/energy rate because of the new players who want to participate and finish old cities. After all, 5 energy points for leveling can not forever give possibility to go to another level. Give more than 2 exp points for fights and give excellent and frequent loot that can make some account much better. Make more more properties like Depot or Shop in all cities to allow players make small but important influence to accounts. Make new city or new episodes in existing ones (they have already engine-template to do that easy) with balance approach for finishing them like they did in Vegas (combination of fight, energy and social) Change some mistakes they have - BIG quantity of money needed for Bangkok and a loot of stun guns needed for Vegas because that is what also generate spam clicking and need for as much energy as player can have. And last, but not the least - FIRE out from company people who think that they have good ideas about this game and save it from going to history.

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  29. It's a consumable job, but "Dispose of the Evidence" (Vegas District 5) is paying me 111 XP for 57 energy at Tier 3 Mastery; with my bonus from my mafia, this is actually 122 for 57, or 2.14 ratio.

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  30. Nice to see a lot of discussion! As far as the Daily Active Users go, this info is available for free on www.appdata.com - just click on the mafia wars tab. They keep track of how many people play monthly and daily.

    Monthly Active Users refers to the amount of accounts who have logged into mafia wars over the last month, daily = logged in that day.

    At any rate, people always complain about sequels to MMOs, but it ALWAYS happens. Everyone cries wolf and how they will never play the new game.

    Then, when you start playing the new game and get the initial feeling of excitement surrounding building a new character, it's easy to forget about the old game.

    It's happened with every successful game ever.

    And I agree with the earlier comments.. I think there are very few players who have an "energy only" account, especially not dedicated players. It would get boring pretty quick to have a single account that was energy only.

    What this does is, players who have energy accounts will be able to easily either 1) farm the best loot themselves and gift it over to their main accounts or 2) turn their energy account into a balanced account.

    My level 2000 energy account can level 20x in a day and boost my attack by 100 stat points a day if I felt like it. I could probably fly up to 3000 attack in a month with 501 of the best loot and win the vast majority of my fights. New players won't be able to compete with that. Period.

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  31. I think what some people are missing here is Stamina points still pay out at over 2x - but they're a lot harder to use. I can't imagine trying use 5,000 stamina points fighting.

    There are really two basic kinds of MW players - fighters and completionists/collectors. Neither is helped by the energy nerf.

    What I don't understand is what problem is Zynga trying to solve? If it ain't broke, don't screw with it! Who cares if people can have energy accounts that power-level? If they are having fun and playing the game, then that's a win! If you take it away so they don't have fun anymore, you're just shooting yourself in the foot.


    As an aside, I think Bangkok is the best city in terms of game balance. Too much money required to level jobs, but the scarcity of cash and the high-cost faction items were actually a very good decision.

    Which they totally undid with almost entirely worthless Vegas cash.

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  32. Couple more thoughts....

    Whoever Zynga has that sets the RP point price for things needs to be fired. I realize that RP are how Zynga makes money. The problem is, they have no idea how to set the pricing for things. I think the loot prices are OK - but then they do things like charge 8 RP to avoid waiting 4 hours to fight in a tournament again where the payoffs are questionable at best. How about making that 1 RP? Nobody will spend 8, but lots would spend 1... you'd get a lot more RP burned at 1 RP than 8.


    And...

    Did anyone think that Zynga doesn't WANT 7 million players?

    Maybe Zynga made a business decision that they'd rather have 1 million players who buy RP than 7 million who don't.

    I don't know if that will lead to more profits or not - there's something to be said about network effects (and does Zynga get a share of the ad revenue for people viewing their pages?) - but losing users that don't buy RP (and cutting server costs) may be a business goal.

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  33. im getting a 2.13 job ratio on district 5, arrange a cartel sale (3rd star) my energy account is leveling up like crazy and getting some good loots

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  34. las vegas loot isn't giftable, right?

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  35. Have you noticed you can get the Zynga Poker achievements again?

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  36. Yeah, the Gold Level District 5 is easily the best ROI rates in the game. I held there (I had a feeling the rates would drop for Ruby) while finishing everything else except for the Trieste Ruby fight.

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  37. so..... when at tier 4 in all districts, the ratio would no longer be 2:1 (because my isn't..)?? dang... this is another fun-killer for me as well.... initially, i would only spend all my energies in bangkok, doing the 'Silence A Shadow Kingdom Patrol' in episode 7. at that time it had a 2.03/1 ratio PLUS a chance to get a Chain Viper 46Att 33Def, which i think is a double bonus compared to other jobs.. nontheless, they nerfed this one too and it really realllyyy took d playing pleasure away....sigh~~~

    mafia wars 2? hurmm... i don't know... my morale of playing games that requires a lot of time, effort, and energy to build up our very own desirable character has gone down the drain... I bet if they really created a mafia wars 2, they would not get the same amount of players that are very commited as they did in the first game....

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  38. I am a balanced account with roughly 2000 in attack,defense and energy. I have 896 stamina and 580 health. I have completed jobs through ruby level District 5. I have the ruby boss fights of 3,4,and 5 to complete.

    My question is where do I find the fight consumables? Has anyone found consistant jobs that at least will randomly drop in New York or Vegas?

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  39. The consumables for boss fights seem to drop everywhere -randomly- with the exception of the grenades which do not drop in New York.

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  40. @ anon august 1st 3:37 and 10:04 am

    Yeap arrange a cartel sale, gold lv, d5. I can power level off this one non-stop

    http://tinypic.com/r/25fj5zn/3

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  41. Daily I am of mixed feelings of whether i want to stay or quit MW. I have quit VW. I got soooo bored and frustrated. I gave up. I haven't looked back since.

    At the moment, I finally got into Vegas, have built all of my properties, used some RP to upgrade said properties, which I don't have a problem with now that you can earn RP thru the slot machine. I like the paths idea. I like that I can do the shout outs for help and I like that I can use stamina in jobs. Do I rob properties anymore? Not so much these days.

    I don't care for the "how-popular-you-are-with-your-mafia" bit so I gave up on that too. No big. I see they took away the energy and all you can gain is stamina and blanking here LOL.

    I am also a bit ticked that since Vegas, I am locked out of Moscow. It's been almost 2 weeks now and I've contacted the powers that be twice via the forum. I was very close to finising out Moscow. I was on level 3 of both episodes 5&6. After finally finishing NY (and that last bit sucked with the consumables and almost made me quit) it was gratifying knowing I was near the end of Moscow. Not so now. Stuck on Chapter 2 all levels completed. WTF?

    Some things I'd like to see either here or should they ever have a MW2:

    - consumable drops or the loot you share on your wall should be geared to the location you are currently working in, e.g. if you are in vegas and you get the choice to post something like power tools, then it should be power tools for Vegas and NOT New York.

    - If you need a consumable for a job and you run out (loving the new feature of how much energy/XP/stamina/consumables are left) and you have finished that job giving the consumables, then drop the energy required along with the xp so it makes loot more attainable while not pissing you off (esp if energy is important to you)

    - if in MW2, each location should be something new and fresh and not follow the formula of it's predecessor (sp) New York and Cuba were the same. Moscow was a bit different but then Bangkok was the same mostly (although the faction scale is neat) and now LV is different. They are on the right track.

    -The limitation of 5 helpers or allowing you to help only 5 is ridiculous. 10 would be fair.

    - I see they changed the gifting of items required for property building approx today. Good good. finally. Too much wait time between those changes.

    - collection drops on things where you can only do a once-only cash-in is annoying. I don't need any more valentine stuff thank you very much.

    - perhaps energy can be spent on a percentage based your level. this would help lower leveled mafia and newbies quitting before they get anywhere. high energy is required in moscow for example and if you can only do a job say 3 times before you run out of energy is enough to make a person rethink playing the game.

    - finally, these mini games, e.g. Paris and South Africa, are neat. they were too close together but still a nifty idea. What I didn't like was when they had the double up at the same time and you couldn't use double up in these two places. If you are nearing the end of a location, like I was for Moscow, to make the choice of doing Moscow or South Africa and time is a bit constraining (I do have a full time job after all and no access at work to MW or FB), it can be quite annoying.

    well i've babbled enough LOL just my 2 cents worth!

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  42. Mafia Wars has been dying for some time now.
    I quit the game when many others did in June where they allowed new fighters who could play 24 hours straight could outloot even balanced players who had been playing a year but can only play once/day for less than an hour.

    All of the casual players who have real jobs/lives are quitting becuase it just takes too much TIME to fight fight fight!

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  43. Mike - Level 1600+August 2, 2010 at 3:34 AM

    Guys,

    I am officially quitting Mafia Wars effective today. I had much fun from last year playing this game, spending averaging 1-2hrs everyday for almost full year and beat all my buddies in my friends list (not mafia list though :)). I even went to the states and bought a prepaid card to achieve the Mafia Wars Mobile Achievements!

    But with the recent development of Las Vegas (where they asked you to fight 100k times! to get an achievement (ok, this may not be as crazy as the 999 trillion achievement though), but is crazy enough knowing fighting is not easy to do.

    Boss that is another crazy idiot who will whack you with one blow and I assume at least 3000attack with 3000defense and 3000health to do the trick.

    They expect us to play probably 6months for last vegas to reach the peak, but thats it, I am pulling the straw. Knowing after I reach those achievement - nobody care in the end. I already knew in the beginning when I started to play that this day would come, but I didnt know it will be this soon.

    So, just wanna thanks Zynga for the great game, too bad I wont be part of this game from now on.

    Have fun to all the players and Thanks!
    Mike

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  44. New players will be able to progress at the same rate I did when I started, new players will have the chop shop and weapon depot, as well as all the really easy stat points from cuba, plus back in the day, having a 10% wheelman and mastermind was better than the average. "Catching up" will be hard, but thats always how things are when you start 2 years later than someone else.

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  45. what some have not said. Now asa new player you have no hope of getting through anything fast. No joy of discovering "tricks" like repeating "settle a beef" in order to get through NY without dumping everything in energy. B4 you could be a balanced player - now you can not.
    Zynga just keeps cutting off its nose to spite its face, and the user stats show it. *sigh*

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  46. All Zynga games spiked at the same time. Odds are is that Zynga does notice the drops in DAU'/MAU's and are screwing with the reporting numbers.

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  47. i used to level nons-top with district 5 gold. but then i finally had the fighting jobs done and went to ruby. now the ratios are down. i hate that. wouldnt you epect them to go up or at least change if you progress? and now with the nerf i cannot powerlvl at all anymore.

    i have an lvl 3536 energy account and this game loses its thrill for me. bangkok was a pain with all the money required, vegas is unfinishable for me due to bosses.

    its time to stop playing.

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  48. well, i think new players aren't that handicapped. yes, the energy:xp ratio isn't as good as it was when most players finished the earlier cities. but on the other hand there is the chop shop and the weapons depot, where you can get extra energy and stamina very easy. so, watching the hole lineup, the odds for good leveling could be the same as in times where we had not that much extra stat stuff...

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  49. Hey everyone,


    this will be my first and last comment on this page. As from now on I’ll quit MW for a number of reasons. I discovered the game about a year ago, got kind of addicted to it (Good Job, Zygna!^^) and played it frenetically. I am now proud owner of two Lvl 1100+ Characters (Energy Accounts). I’m not quitting not only because of the new nerf, but mainly because IMO the MafiaWars gaming experience in its whole got worse month by month.



    First of all, does anyone remember, back then, when you mastered a single tier in NY you had a huge feeling of satisfaction, because you actually accomplished something!? You got more experience from jobs, 10% off on this and that, your chances of getting a loot item improved etc!? Mastering a tier didn’t get you a silly single Car/Weapon/Animal, that is as useful as a fridge at the north pole, because most Lvl 50-player with a maxed out mafia can beat me (90+ members) with 500 knives and 500 tomatoes.


    Now with every new city they throw items at you like it’s Christmas and my loot item list has become unmanageable (my mouse-wheel starts smoking, when I want find an item to add to my wish list) and getting new items has become inflationary. As there are no new real accomplishments, Cuba, Moscow, Bangkok and now Las Vegas became interchangeable. And the new currency converting tool in my Las Vegas vault is a bad joke. I’m sitting on hundreds of millions in the currency of their respective cities/countries and Zygna doesn’t allow converting a decent amount of your hard-earned money because they want you to buy their reward points that you can convert into game money.


    The whole game has become a behemoth. They added tournaments, poker, the one–armed bandit, fights and even more fights, crime spree, properties, a to-do-list, team-collections here, collections there, South-Africa, Paris and I-don’t-know-what. This makes it hard for me to keep track of every aspect of game. Oh wait, and I can photograph my casino, this will certainly get me ehrm... "respect"! One could argue that this new “improvements” give you something for the time after you spend your energy and stamina, but it’s just tiresome and the winnable items, for the most part, are a joke.


    Finally, Zygnas’decision to switch to Flash-based gaming drives me crazy, especially for jobs in Vegas: *click*, *waaaait*, *click*, *waaait*, *click*, *ARGH* (and with the new focus on fighting even more so). When I want to spend my 7000 Energy Points I''d better get started early in the morning so I’ll be finished before dinner…

    All this nuisances didn’t just fall from the sky, they slowly build up and every new city contributed its part (not for the good) to quit MW. I really liked MW and recommended it to my friends, but even if MW2 will be released – I have grown tired of these “social games”, not to speak of privacy issues (Yes, Zygna, I don’t trust you).


    In the end, I want to thank the creator of this page for the superb MW guides, I read them on an regular basis. They were of great use to me.


    Now, back to the real world!


    Greetings from Germany

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  50. I also wish to thank the creator of these pages, they have been highly useful. But I must say the only way to win at Mafia Wars is to not play!

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  51. Dammit. They're still tweaking.
    I was getting 159 for 79 doing the "Arrange a Cartel Sale" until just now. I'm now getting 170 for 86. Not a big difference but still a loss.

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  52. Ya, gold level went from 2.13 or so to 2.06

    They change things up every couple days, from drop rates, to xp ratios, to game mechanics. It's getting tiring. I've been sitting on a few hundred skill points since a month before LV waiting to see where I should invest them once the dust settles. I have a feeling it will never settle.

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  53. So which job currently gives the best ratio?

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  54. I believe they just went through and nerfed Las Vegas. I've put a lot into energy, which helps mastering Vegas and all, but District 3 gold, and district 5 ruby...bosses are out of control. But back to the nerf, I regret not trying to boost a few weeks ago. For some reason one night, I was getting mastery bonuses every 4 or 5 missions, so I "settled the beef" constantly, and I leveled like, 18 times straight up, then got tired and slept, woke up the next morning...couldn't do it again...dang.

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  55. I don't know if any one noticed (or i missed the post) but the fight ratio went down as well. It used to be that stamina is about 2.15 to 2.45, but now I'm in the 1.7 to 1.8 range.

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  56. not true. within the last 1000 fights I had still an average ratio of 2.15.
    I think there was a post somewhere before. If you fight iced targets, you get a max of 2 xp per stamina...

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  57. in the long run (round about 20000 fights) I alwas had a ratio of 2.32. For the last 3000 fights I just have 2.17. But thats still a very good ratio...

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  58. sucks about the arrange a cartel job ratio nerf, now have to figure out a new way to power level maybe with consumables. ohh well, anyways was reading thru the comments and kinda agree with the person who said only way to win w/ mafia wars is to quit playing

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  59. in district 4 is a job, that still pays a ratio of 2.01 so don't cry about the district 5 job...

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  60. Anyone notice the drop in exp/stamina ratio for fighting to >2?

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  61. Ok. It is possible to beat all bosses at level 4 in district 1,2,3,4. Only for district 3 you need a loot of Vegas money. How it is possible to beat last boss fight at level 4 if I do not have big energy to collect a loot from energy jobs?!?!?!?!
    Damn! It is really annoying to try that fight again and again with no chance to finish it.

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  62. OF course another perspective is that Zynga wnated the energy accounts to stop playing the game since they mostly just fed loot to others

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  63. I noticed a few posts this week about zynga deleting accounts that use gift chuckers, anyone else hear about this? I have been playing mw for 4 months. They keep adding new things but they have so many problems to fix with the game already. Once I complete vegas I will probably quit! In my opinion, this guide & the readers comments are the best things about mw!!! Keep up the great work guys!

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  64. Hei guise!
    Cuba's suddenly valuable again! Remember all those thousands of politico corruptos that are collecting dust (I have ~ 2700)?

    [format: energy exp (politico corrupto) (exp/energy)]

    (patron) Establish A Loansharking Business
    44 90 (3)(2.045)

    (padrino) Set Up A High Volume Smuggling Operation
    49 101 (5)(2.061)

    (cacique) Help Get An Associate A No Bid Contract
    50 106 (8)(2.12)

    Granted, even 2700 politico corrupto won't help you powerlevel for long, but it still has a new use. Getting poker chips requires energy, but you get free politcos every day.

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  65. Has the fighting loot drop rate in Vegas dropped? I'm getting about one piece for every 2000 energy in District 4 & 5 (Ruby) - and about half of what I do get are crap (Dune Buggy, SMG, Bighorn Ram).

    I'm okay with the pieces dropping randomly from random jobs - as opposed to the old system where you could just farm specific loot from specific jobs, but only so long as loot is actually dropping.

    I'm running out of reasons to play Vegas. I'd like to build up $50mil or so to have a run at Trieste (I figure 750 hit points per 1.7m per health refresh after taking 4000 points in the initial stun gun/shiv/grenade barrage will run me around $46mill +/- to take her out - assuming she doesn't regenerate, or I show up on the fight list,). On second thought, $70mill might be safer.

    But just playing jobs to build up cash - while not really collecting any useful loot - is for sucks.

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  66. I can understand why they nerfed some jobs, I made 400 levels in 2 weeks just by doing the same lvl 7 bangkok job, they must have spotted quite a few guys doing the same and it was kind of unfair to the non energy accounts

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  67. Anon 8:21,
    the problem is "a few guys" recently.

    The problem has been that nobody at Zynga seems to have studied mathematics or economics, much less game theory. The game has been horribly out of balance since before I started playing it (14 months ago). They keep papering over the cracks in the foundation while building more stories.

    The game is destined to collapse at some point. There are just too many players, and too many collaborative groups of players playing not to exploit the parts of the game that are way out of balance. And the imbalances are so so fundamental, that they can't just "fix it".

    Especially since they drive significant revenues from casual players who spend money on RPs. They are reaping what they've sown for the last couple of years. Not paying attention to the internal economics of the game, not policing the stated rules (identifying and shutting down second/third/fiftieth farm accounts and deleting the transferred loots), not immediately addressing customer issues.

    By letting the game run itself - while allowing large numbers of players to invest themselves monetarily into the game, they've basically created a monster where they can only provide tweaks.

    Even an introductory college level course in Game Theory for the lead developers would likely have prevented most of the problems we see today.

    The best of several bad options for them is to just let the game burn itself out. Keep taking the money from folks willing to keep paying, and as long as those revenues are sufficient, keep adding new content. The fact is, they'll continue raking in cash from MafiaWars for some time to come from the casual players who want to "catch up" without all the drudgery of playing.

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  68. I'm tired of Zygna's constant nerfing. I haven't played since Saturday. I'm going to take a few more days off, then log in, send my HEL to certain members of my mafia who have been especially helpful in the past, and then quit. I've done way too much whining and complaining about the game. It's time to get my life back and do other things that are more enjoyable. I want to thank Mafia Wars Strategy Guide for all of the helpful info provided to make the game more enjoyable, but I've concluded that the game is now a lost cause.

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  69. I've been playing this game regularly since i started Jan this year. I have never power levelled on a particular job and just played by order finishing one job to the next. The nerf doesn't affect and bother me at all. I think, this game lost the vast majority of players when the show similar post started and then when the war page got screwed-up i lost a lot of my mafia players. And recently with the emphasis on fighting, a lot of hi lvl players icing low lvl players and constant attacks from other players has demoralized some players maybe. The hitlist page now has a lot of targets compared to before. Btw, for the tournaments, i always have the best odds, but never seem to win, that really sucks but i keep on trying. Not quitting just yet. Happy playing guys and really enjoy reading the comments.

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  70. Dear Mr. Mafia Wars Guide,

    With all these dissatisfaction and pressure felt by most loyal MW players around the world due to the gradual nerfing that has been going on up until now, what will you do?

    Will you quit the game too, eventually? Do share what you plan to do if the situation gets worse in the future. I'm sure everyone around this blog of yours are also eager to know...

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  71. WTF? 4 top job loot?

    http://imm.io/VNg

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  72. Anyone else having issues with putting things on your wishlist. I couldn't put nak kha shotgun on my WL.Maybe its just me,..

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  73. I am at about lvl 500 and I have a balanced approach.

    Even before the nerfs I was only leveling at about 2 or maybe 3x per day. I don't notice the nerfs and I don't care. Las Vegas is way more fun than the other cities because of all the new content, and the mini missions like South Africa are great as well. Mafia wars with its limited resource approach is more addictive than my Xbox games and I probably won't stop playing unless they do something like ban my account.

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  74. I totaly agree with the last comment!

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  75. anyone noticed that they nerfed fighting too? loot only drops when fighting alive players, also the xp ratio drops to 1.6-1.7 whilst fighting dead players. basically there is no point in burning your stamina on one person anymore.

    but in return, i had to upgrade my stamina from 200 to 800 to get through vegas, and now they took away my way of spending stamina? are they really thinking people are gonna sit down and click 800 times to fight people(not even counting the search for suitable vitims)???

    what the heck? are they willing to make this game shit just to piss of the autoplayer people, or what?

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  76. I probably won't play MW2 but if they created such a game, I'd be opposed to the completely automatic distribution of stats. Customization and personalization is an essential part of any RPG.

    As a slight modification to the idea while retaining the same spirit, I propose instead to provide a series of sliders that automates allocations of skill points as a percentage of those accumulated in the future. An overview would show the percentage total allocation so far. Zynga could institute a limit to how frequently the allocation sliders could be updated and force a minimum.

    As I have started to get bored of the game, I've used this blog less frequently but it was once a regular source of information and ideas. I've occasionally challenged some suggestions posted.

    Did anyone notice that they changed the name of the game? I surmise it helped them hide the fact that players have declined. It now shows the "Mafia Wars Game" as having an "all time high" of 9million DAU whereas the information page for the same appData page lists "Mafia Wars" with over 21million as the all time high of *that* application.

    I have seen in the official forums much talk of MW's demise. Now, I see talk of it from you and can't help but agree.

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  77. hahaha. the autoplayer does everything for you... just click "skip iced targets" and everything is fine...

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  78. Another nerf on the horizon: only being able to use 50 mafia in a fight. Check out the message I saw on my fight screen menu today:

    "BETA! Martial Law has been declared! Larger gatherings are banned, so now you can only bring 50 mafia members to a fight - make sure they have the best items!"

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  79. The bosses stink. I may quit because of them. Level 3 boss 25000 points and level 5 boss 4000 but has to backup. On level 5 you knockout the backups and it takes about 8 stun guns. Then that leaves 2 for boss. You get ten more stun guns and the henchmen are back. AWTF

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  80. Changes to fighting:
    Loot only drops on live targets
    EXP = 1 or 2 on iced targets; 1 to 6 on live targets

    New fighting Loot:
    Buzzard Combat Chopper (Vehicle) 54/30
    Tasmanian Devil (Animal) 53/38
    Domestic Defense (Armor) 53/35
    Woodsman (Weapon) 27/54

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  81. You asked why the user spike, and I haven't seen the answer posted here: They are giving away $25,000. Or at least that is what it says when I go to Las Vegas. You can up your chances by heading to Vegas more often, so I suspect people are flooding the game hoping to win.

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  82. But the bottom line is that Zynga is in it for the MONEY and altruistic behavior on our behalf is not heir guiding philosophy. So if ADU drop they will that means $ drops and that means a response from Z. Show them the money folks.

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  83. @Carl Starrett you are perfectly right! Having the same experience, once I manage to collect the items those two are back again, tried to come back 3-4 times but barely managed to take half of the Boss life... I'm on mixed account with more than 4000+ points in energy, also used GF points to recharge my energy and my daily energy pack to be able to collect the items but still no luck... f**k this s**t :-/ only those 2 Bosses remained on ruby level to finish up Las Vegas, now I'm building up my health and attack points... this game is not so fun anymore...

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  84. Dear MWG and the readers of this blog,

    I am writing my farwell comment to this blog which i have been reading ever since it was published to the internet. Currently I have been playing Mafia Wars for over 2 years now. Here's an account link : https://www.google.com/accounts/TokenAuth?auth=APh-3FyPAiR9P_udQQKqGjzTJvcSSnk_zlf95bjVytdHsZNNzNzsAaVJLAAPAw4pt3e8hUbR9iu21Vb_lZUiBFqITKDDZ4AMzlBP_XZ1jeJqMhsLBUJRQPGhf5nKp1CJp7SXu9r6SCs7gUOA7LN2KmWuHkGQ3cBHuSbV2oSQE1wrJ3xtldE7RBMkoAf9FB9E41upe3g7fFJARrSaVbSVhzoiME_euwrMDSXsJFhnPAYCl0D_dlwnYZHSEUvVpNNj8Kc7EzIzvSmVo2LlsaxqTswOCaRrMU5pENOZAD3qlani3zP0OH7eG2m9HX-FSXINl291d0m8TiphfSkde7J1nsZ9Wg6Fs79f7FM7quCH9-a4P6ghIw3aozZwNHX2dahRSql-Ah4itXxnMrDxMFODzmrIhRP3fo3WaZ2Pg_8UgGycrv8LPN18fwyWrP-GddzlZAmqyTiWS-ahwxhfcancRQz8o9a2Wc4cVIpiUG0nrbBzRyLg3AORA059xzYD65MqlI0EzusoBZXZWxFMyDRWTmGePda_5nGd4RJEMt0SA_OM-OnCjsa43rMBX0n-iomOWuLnEZPovogsLSXZ3WHUkOSHqX62Oo_AhsUy6-Mvk4Lw3-EcUiNMhkP67t2SIWqDt4pYLE3XZBwz1m8aIb1k0Fs14O-6rV-rXLXjo1UGEI7nZVxycSRBDv3sOlpntDbIk7nlpBIYvOpQwCdEYMsKVRr1UpPfQswOfw,,&service=lh2&source=picasa2&continue=http://picasaweb.google.com/lh/sredir%3Funame%3D112273965931506262260%26target%3DPHOTO%26id%3D5502108119219444738 I enjoyed it but it's over i can't handle anymore of this nonesense!!! feel free to enjoy my picture of this wonderful account gone to waste by zynga. maybe i should sell it??? who knows what will happen to this amazing account that was treated for over 2 years. WHO KNOWS??? THANKS MWG AND THE READERS OF THIS BLOG FOR LETTING ME ENJOY MYSELF!!! THANKS!

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  85. DAU=Daily ACTIVE Users, not Annual

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  86. tooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooo boring without leveling up ................ L(

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  87. wOOooohhhoooOOoo!! I took Out Juliana!! yO!!

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  88. I feel the pain- I have an energy account and don't stand a chance in hell of beating any of the Vegas bosses at Silver.

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  89. aprilius20-

    second the comment on bosses; it seems ones needs 400-500 health points
    1,500 attack points
    1,500 defense points
    level 1200
    to be able to take out all of the LA ruby level bosses, that and a full set of consumables along with three players who are also as strong; each should have a spare energy pack and a full stamina bank with 900 stamina points.

    If one has the above one can regularly take out and dispatch any of the LA ruby level bosses fairly methodically, though one may have to work on allocating consumbables carefully between the LA henchmen and the Bosses; like use the stun grenades to take out the henchmen so one can save more stun grenades for effective use on the LA boss where one can deal more effective damage; also one needs to let one die in boss fight before healing again to fight another round with LA boss after resupplying with more boss fight consumables(stun grenades, shive, stun guns,etc.)

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